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Necoa #: 8721
Location: 13(TX)
Joined: Dec 22, 2006
Posts: 333
Year: 1983
Model: El Camino
Posted: Sun May 25, 2008 5:56 pm Post subject: Float Bowl going dry
On my 1983 EC with 229 V6 and Dual Jet carb I am having a problem that is frustrating and wasteful of fuel.
When the car sits for 48 hours it is very hard to start and takes a lot of cranking and kicking the gas pedal to inject fuel into the system. And I am talking about night time temperatures in the LOW 80s and day time temps of 95F, so its not cold. I have tracked this down to the fact that after 24 to 48 hours the float bowl is dry, ( I opened the carb to look!) thus requiring the fuel pump to fill it again before it will start.
The bowl is vented through a brass pipe about the size of my little finger and is also vented through the space (clearance) between the accelerator pump shaft and the top of the carb. It would seem this latter vent should be enough to pressure equalise the bowl without that huge stove pipe through which all my fuel can evaporate.
What would be the effect if I were to plug that large vent pipe? _________________ Jim
1983 El Camino
Necoa #: 7195
Location: 17(S.CA,S.NV)
Joined: Mar 26, 2006
Posts: 843
Year: 1977
Model: El Camino
Posted: Sun May 25, 2008 8:25 pm Post subject:
Jim, That would be unknown to me. But a little experiment wouldn't do any harm. Take a peace of rubber tubbing of sorts that will go over that vent, block off the open end, run the car for a while, then drive the car a bit and see if you notice any adverse effects. If not, then park the car for that 24 hour period, then check if will then start for you of if the same prob. re-occurs. That will give you something to go on in your future evaluation. Hope this helps, thing like that can be so frustrating.
_________________ http://elcaminocentral.com/gallery-album_CoyoteOn2s77Cage.html
Keep the Shiney Side Up
The Rubber Side Down !!
aka Larry
Necoa #: 8721
Location: 13(TX)
Joined: Dec 22, 2006
Posts: 333
Year: 1983
Model: El Camino
Posted: Sun May 25, 2008 9:36 pm Post subject:
I was planing on doing just that tomorrow. I will let you know how it comes out.
I noticed your sig line. I take it you were in racing? I was in Formula racing. Our moto was "Race?... Hell, we're just here for the cocktail party." I drove an FF and FA for two years. _________________ Jim
1983 El Camino
Jim, it sounds like you have a leak in one of the fuel-well plugs. It's a common problem with Rochester carburetors. The fuel in the bowl will leak down into the intake over a period of time. If that is the case the only way you can fix it is by opening up the carb and sealing them all with epoxy. _________________ Ernie
87 El Camino
"To be Old and Wise, you must first be Young and Stupid"
Necoa #: 7195
Location: 17(S.CA,S.NV)
Joined: Mar 26, 2006
Posts: 843
Year: 1977
Model: El Camino
Posted: Sun May 25, 2008 9:55 pm Post subject:
Jim, as Ernie said, I forgot about those four plugs. Back in the day, (Ernie maybe you know this trick also) we use to cut a chunk off an old wheel weight, (lead) and punch it in the plug holes with a drift punch and re-seal them that way. But that was before Epoxy & you didn't have to wait for it to dry.
_________________ http://elcaminocentral.com/gallery-album_CoyoteOn2s77Cage.html
Keep the Shiney Side Up
The Rubber Side Down !!
aka Larry
Jim
Here is some info from a post I wrote a while back that I found. By small wire brush, I mean something like a copper fitting cleaning brush.
"The other problem q-jets have that make them run rich is the two plugs in the base of the float bowl begin to leak. These can be accessed by removing the base from the bowl. Kits come with a small triangular shaped foam piece to lay in the base to apply upward pressure to the plugs. This alone won't last long. Use a small wire brush and totally clean the plugs and the small area of aluminum around them. Use a heat gun or something similar and warm them to the point they are just too hot to touch and then apply a light coat of epoxy(heating them lets the epoxy penetrate around them and set up quicker). Let that cure, install the foam and reinstall the base. This fix is usually good for about 10 years and has to be done again"
If you don't have the foam don't worry it is just added insurance. If you try to make something, test it first to make sure gasoline doesn't eat it.
You have probably found by now that if you plug the vent it will starve for fuel under acceleration. Evaporation out the bowl vent is not the problem. If you have that much clearance around the pump shaft that you think the bowl will vent there - the bowl cover is worn out. _________________ 84 Elky with 455 Buick, Tremec TKO600 5 speed, 8.5 3:42 posi -
My Members Page Album
Another 3 to 9 years should finish it.
Necoa #: 6858
Location: 7(AL,GA,TN)
Joined: Feb 07, 2006
Posts: 937
Year: 1970
Model: El Camino
Posted: Mon May 26, 2008 9:38 am Post subject: leaking casting plugs
The plugs in my car have been leaking for a while and that has been on my to do list. I have read about a more permanent fix though. The story goes that NAPA has a kit with O ringed plugs. You drive out the old ones, clean up the holes and press in the new ones, end of leak. _________________ Jim
70 ElCamino 461 solid M20 331eaton
http://elcaminocentral.com/gallery-album_album346.html
Necoa #: 8721
Location: 13(TX)
Joined: Dec 22, 2006
Posts: 333
Year: 1983
Model: El Camino
Posted: Mon May 26, 2008 10:14 am Post subject:
Just what is the purpose of plugged holes in the first place....just to make something the mechanics can feed their family's with? Why wasnt it made solid to start with? _________________ Jim
1983 El Camino
Necoa #: 8721
Location: 13(TX)
Joined: Dec 22, 2006
Posts: 333
Year: 1983
Model: El Camino
Posted: Mon May 26, 2008 10:19 am Post subject:
Larry,
it was in my younger days as well, but I have more than memories....I have a Lola FF/FA stored away in the garage in case I ever want to try it again. I should sell it though as I need the room for my other projects. _________________ Jim
1983 El Camino
The purpose of the plugged holes was to allow them to drill the fuel passages in the bowl. Necessary evil.
I like the idea of the o-ringed ones though. I'll have to check that out. _________________ 84 Elky with 455 Buick, Tremec TKO600 5 speed, 8.5 3:42 posi -
My Members Page Album
Another 3 to 9 years should finish it.
Necoa #: 8721
Location: 13(TX)
Joined: Dec 22, 2006
Posts: 333
Year: 1983
Model: El Camino
Posted: Mon May 26, 2008 4:45 pm Post subject:
Can you see the plugs from above? I looked into the bown and see onl,y the two jets that the metering rods fit into. I dont see any other plugs in the bowl except for one screw at the front. Not sure what that is. _________________ Jim
1983 El Camino
Necoa #: 8721
Location: 13(TX)
Joined: Dec 22, 2006
Posts: 333
Year: 1983
Model: El Camino
Posted: Mon May 26, 2008 5:10 pm Post subject:
Yes, I understand that. I removed the top and looked down into the bowl. There are two jets toward the front into which the metering rods go and there is a screw a bit forward of that, but no "plugs" _________________ Jim
1983 El Camino
Necoa #: 7195
Location: 17(S.CA,S.NV)
Joined: Mar 26, 2006
Posts: 843
Year: 1977
Model: El Camino
Posted: Mon May 26, 2008 5:43 pm Post subject:
464elky wrote:
Jim
"The other problem q-jets have that make them run rich is the two plugs in the base of the float bowl begin to leak. These can be accessed by removing the base from the bowl.
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