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Posted: Wed Aug 13, 2008 8:43 pm Post subject: Ram air intake/forced air intake
I have a 1980 Elkie with a 223 CID 6 Cylinder. Ok, now that you have stopped laughing, here is the question. Would one of these ram air kits I see at the parts store do any good for my engine? I have seen tv shows where they put the intake under the grill by various means. I have the air cleaner that has the flap that opens when its cold to allow warm exhaust gas in. Any opinions? _________________ I didn't touch it. I swear.
Necoa #: 572
Location: 10(IL,MN,WI)
Joined: Jan 28, 2003
Posts: 3617
Year: 1984
Model: El Camino
Posted: Wed Aug 13, 2008 8:58 pm Post subject: Re: Ram air intake/forced air intake
elkiebob wrote:
Ok, now that you have stopped laughing,
What makes you think we've stopped? Don't mess with it...just make sure you have a clean air filter...and exhaust gas doesn't enter your carb, it's a heat riser (heat exchanger) that warms the air entering your carb off the exhaust manifold.
Necoa #: 10934
Location: 15(AZ,NM)
Joined: Feb 03, 2008
Posts: 441
Year: 1981
Model: El Camino
Posted: Wed Aug 13, 2008 9:01 pm Post subject:
The cooler the air coming in to the engine the denser it will be. Yes, it will help make a bit more power and maybe a bit more MPG. How big a difference and how long it may take to pay for it self is hard to tell. But the short answer is yes, the cold air kits do help.
What about the heat riser? I am assuming I will have to do without it. That should make it harder to warm up on cold days ( should it ever again get cold in Atlanta). _________________ I didn't touch it. I swear.
Necoa #: 10934
Location: 15(AZ,NM)
Joined: Feb 03, 2008
Posts: 441
Year: 1981
Model: El Camino
Posted: Wed Aug 13, 2008 9:40 pm Post subject:
You could keep it. But then what would be the point of using the cold air set up???? The car will run fine with out the heat riser. Might take a bit longer for the choke to pull off though.
It proboably wont make a big difference. If its a little better than the stock set up you have on there and doesnt cost you a whole lot of money i would say go for it. Cooler air is always better.
A little bit of something is better than a whole lot of nothing.
Let me make sure I add or re-emphasize this: I live in Atlanta, home of the drought, the heat is surely brave. Won't this keep my engine cooler?Although my vehicle was made in Doraville, Ga in 1980. _________________ I didn't touch it. I swear.
Necoa #: 2321
Location: 15(AZ,NM)
Joined: Jan 30, 2004
Posts: 1168
Year: 1974
Model: El Camino
Posted: Fri Aug 15, 2008 8:25 pm Post subject:
I had a 229 in an 81 camaro. Thing was a dog till an old race mechanic bored it out and put a race cam in it. Of course then it wouldn't pass emissions.
It's not that a RAM air setup wouldn't benefit a carbureted motor it's just that to take full advantage it's best to set up the carb to take advantage of the extra airflow or your gains won't be noticeable. RAM Air was an advantage on the Muscle era Hurst olds and 442's and added about 15HP but the carbs were jetted differently to take advantage of the higher air pressure.
The Chevelle SS Cowl setup is really just a reversed RAM AIR setup too, only it draws from low pressure windshield airflow. Shaker hood setups on Roadrunners and Boss Mustangs were another form of RAM air as were the 73 Firebird TA scoops. They closed them off in later years so that they were just for show. EPA didn't like the chance of fuel vapors leaking out.
67 to 69 Firebirds and GTO's had Ram Air options that were much like the SS cowl induction setup.
Even the 80 Z28 had functional cowl induction with flappers that were vacuum triggered and solenoid actuated.
All those cars were carbureted and benefitted from RAM air. The 229 isn't worth trying it with though. I personally like the 231 Buick better which was the other V6 option on the Chevy's of that era.
The best advice is to just keep it in good tune. RAM Air won't make your car any cooler in the summer either. The ducting goes to the air cleaner not the interior of your car. It may make the motor run a little cooler because of the denser air charge which should help combustion and let you take some timing out of it. That's with a little better motor though. Again, I wouldn't go nuts with a 229.
_________________ 74 El Camino Classic - project car #1
96 Camaro - RIP, Traded 10-16-2007
2008 Mustang GT, It ain't a Chevy but at least it's American!
Why not ? When you are young "going nuts" translates into "let her rip and lets have some fun" You want on demand power from that dog you call a motor ? Spray it a little and be done with it. Its only money... _________________ Chillin in Lauderdale
I think Snaggle has a 229 CID as well and just wants to be sure his is the coolest.
LMAO yeah buddy I wanna be coo with a 229. Had a 350 in my 78 buddy. Anyways the reason being it wont benifit your engine to "run cooler" is cause cold air entering the engine WILL NOT make it run colder. It will only make the air charge dense so the charge will combust better. But wait before you remove your pants. Your car already HAS this feature in your carburetor, if you read about carbs or how cars work you might understand the "Venturi" effect. If you want to know more on how a venturi effect works read this
Then once you understand that then a little bit of physics I belive comes into play. Once the air has been squished into a smaller area, the air passing through the smaller portion is hot air being sucked from your air cleaner. Once it passes that smaller passage a heat exchange happens, cause the air had to work its way through the smaller passage making it become denser. After it leaves that smaller portion and is allowed to escape into a larger area the air becomes cooler in thus the reason why you dont need a cold air intake for carburetors. Thats why emission equipped vehicles usually have "hot air" going through the intake so on start ups your carb doesnt "ice" up and cause it to stall and not run or run properly.
Now on EFI vehicles say for example a LS1. There is no venturi effect in the intake system and only hot air passes through the intake and the shortly after sucked into combustion chamber. Having a cold air intake allows the air to become dense before it enters the intake manifold so when it mixes with the fuel from when the injector is opened the mixture between the 2 mix better and have a stronger formation.
My theories are pretty correct on all this, I COULD BE WRONG. But I'm no teacher, but i do know what I'm talking about. You could of saved your self by using the SEARCH function on the forms dating pretty far back where a good ol member of the name Mrappi would explain why you dont need cold air on your vehicle.
I have an '80 229, and I can tell you a cold air intake does nothing but help the air filter get dirty faster.
The '78 and '79 200ci V6s had the cold air snorkle. GM discontinued that because there was no real advantage. With 200 degree water in the aluminum intake, plus the exhaust gas crossover, you're not really going to cool the incoming air.
Re the heat stove, if you take that off you'll just end up with cold-start stalling. The choke is electric, and it is calibrated to open quickly, so that hot air is necessary to keep from stalling.
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